[ballen]

I posted several weeks ago about trouble playing poor players in a home game...

we had "poker night" again this last weekend, and I had moments where I played better, but still struggled.

we play no limit tournament... there were 7 of us...

the problem is that way too many people will stay in the pot to see the flop... and even had people (I was shocked at this) calling down to the river... and even calling a bet on the river with Ace high...

it's one thing to BLUFF with no hand... but to CALL with no hand was amazing...

I would play aggressively, raising with a powerful hand... (and raising a nice solid amound) and 4 or 5 people would stay in... and of course hit something on the flop... and I was toast...

I tried playing looser to match their style... then play less aggressively and just check/call along with middle pair or bottom pair... or even top pair... but everytime I got out of a hand because there were too many other callers... it seemed like I would have won if I stayed in... and when I guessed the other way... betting out with top pair, good kicker... one guy just kept calling... and I figured he was calling me with middle pair... and it turned out he had flopped two pair...

these players don't do the normal stuff to show you when you're beat by re-raising... that sort of thing... so it's a guessing game...

not everyone stays in every hand... but much fewer hands were taken down with no showdown than normal... and many hands had 3 people or more at the showdown...

I started to make a bit of a move middle way through... by going all in with a couple of top hands... and just taking the blinds and early callers money with no flop... but this only works when you're getting premium hands... the cards dried up a little... and I went back into guessing whether my lottery numbers had hit or not...

I'm very frustrated... and can't figure out how to adjust my game to these circumstances...

[lork]

As Mr Brunson has said many times.... you have to play the opposite style to the majority of the table i.e. if they are loose you play super tight and vise versa.

I recommend a read of the Super System, it's made alot of difference to my online play and I suspect it would be twice as effective in a home game scenario.

[pritz]

I have supersystem... and have read and re-read it...

it's good advice... and I tried playing tight early with the only exceptions being seeing the flop for a small price with good potential hands (low suited connecters and A-X suited... and K-X suited... as Doyle suggests)

my problem is that when the flop misses me... (and it was missing me a LOT that night... ) I can get out of some hands.. but can't get out of others because of what I see winning... JUNK!

but you're right... just not getting in the hand in the first place would save my chips long enough until the blinds rise, and others are more shy about staying in for every flop...

[razor]

I don't understand the problem here.

You apparently have their playing styles figured out and you still can't open up a can of whoop azz?

Dude... stalk, isolate and pounce!

The best thing about these types of players is they have no ability to change their style. Sure they may try, but it's like painting a bullseye on their forehead when they do.

And let's not forget, it's called NL for a reason. If these guys are calling you down every single time with crap it's because your betting/raising and/or timing is completely off.

Sacrifice one game by really putting these guys to the test and making them play for much higher stakes when you are in the pot and have the best of it. You will figure out real quick who will turn into jello when they have to call 300 preflop with J3 offsuite and another 500 when they miss the flop. Twist their arm enough during this game and they may figure it out. Hopefully they won't change one bit, but you will gain a huge amount of info about each player.

Trust me, you don't want them changing! You are the one who needs to change in order to turn their crappy play against them.

[ballen]

do you read the posts you reply to?

my last sentence said "I NEED TO LEARN HOW TO ADJUST."

I never said I wanted them to change...

I actually understand that a "huge" raise is the way to really put them to the test... but it seems that THAT is where luck has been against me... and it makes me gunshy...

I've tried raising big...with A-K for example... and they either ALL fold... which is fine... I'll take a small win over a large loss anyday...

but what more often happens, is that I get one or two loose callers, and they hit their hands, and I don't... then they bet out... and If I raise them, I'm risking MY entire stack when I know I'm beat...

Actually, I know that you're right... I need to push harder when I push... and find out where the threshold is that I want to reach... pushing most people out of the pot... but not quite everyone...

my problem is that I've become gunshy because I've tried it and lost huge chunks of my stack when I miss...

[ThomasR]

Frustration indeed. There are a lot of tables like this, particularly in home games. You played right, playing good hands and in general you will beat the people going in with nothing.

However, there is always the risk of them catching on the flop, turn or river and you must monitor the bets to try and judge when this has occurred. In time, you will always be over on these kinds of players because they don't get the cards, they won't be getting a pot anytime soon.

Just time to tighten up and ride it out I'm afraid. Playing wrecklessly as they are isn't the way to go.